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blip
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Posted: 22 February 2010 at 20:44 | IP Logged Quote blip

How to destroy a 9/11 truther.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXWoXfyi9y8



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Outcast
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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 10:57 | IP Logged Quote Outcast


lol

Brilliant

btw. Whats a twoofer ?


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Colgrin
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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 11:24 | IP Logged Quote Colgrin

It was bollox!

It was a simplistic if you don't agree with supposition A then you must believe in supposition B straw man whinge. Very much in line with bushs' if you are not with us then you are with the terrorists line. Which really demonstrates the ideological, if ironic, roots of the 911 truthers.

I mean these looneys guys "claim" that they are "critics", but despite their dodgy claim to be "skeptics" do they ever actually employ the processes they pupport to employ? You know, the scientific method, Occams' razor etc etc.

But then why bother to analyse the facts and engage in proper debate when there are dvds and books to flog to the gullible, and cry like schoolgirls when people dare to question them!

All I can say to the maker of the video is to get a life and grow up!

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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 14:23 | IP Logged Quote PaleRider

We should question everything, i'm not sure what happened on 9/11 but i'm pretty sure Bin Laden had xxx all to do with it.

When we have governments and M'P's as dishonest as you can get without getting a prison sentence why do we attack people who are just asking questions of them?

The US government went 99% of the way to clearing operation northwoods which meant they would kill US citizens deliberatly to further the agenda of the day, why wouldn't they do it again?

Does anyone beleive Dr Kelly killed himself?

We are living in times where nobody trusts the government, hardly anyone wants to vote... why is that?

Because they know nothing is gonna change.

I don't doubt for one minute the US could carry out 9/11, they got a chimp in the shape of Bush to be President, a clown who could easily be controlled and manipulated into going along with it.
And the likes of Cheney and Rumsfeld, Probably the scariest looking bunch since Nazi Germany, changing all the laws and codes just Prior to 9/11.

Cheney himself took control of the entire US defense, just prior to 9/11 and oops, he sends b*gger all off to intecept the planes even though he had 2 hours to think about it.


And to top it all off, George Bush's own Brother was in charge of security at the twin towers on 9/11.

You couldnt't make this stuff up, the facts are out their that i find just bewildering.

And here are some firsts.

1. The first time a plane crashed without finding a black box was on 9/11, and the second plane crash and the 3rd and so on. Impossible say the experts, and yet they found a passport from one of the passengers, a passport that just happened to belong to one of evil ones.

2. The first time steel framed buildings collapse from fire, WTC7 without even being hit by a plane.

3. The first time parts of the WCT towers were "powered down" just prior to 9/11.

and theres many more...

I ask questions on 9/11 and if that makes me a "truther" or a looney i'm proud to be one and will continue to be one.























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Colgrin
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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 16:37 | IP Logged Quote Colgrin

Yes of course we should question what we are being told, and not take what governments tell us for granted. However that scepticism should apply to all not just some. Governments are not some menacing mysterious colossus impervious to understanding, they are institutions and perpetuated by humans, like you and me, and as such are subject to the same attributes as humans, albeit on a collective scale. Thus so as individuals are subject to incompetencies and stupidity, so institutions they create, such as governments are also incompetent and stupid.

Likewise accusations such as “nasty”, “evil” and “deceitful” that are thrown at the government should also be applied to other human institutions when appropriate. This means that the precious, angelic and benevolent connotations of the “truthers” should also be called into question.

In other words, maybe these “truthers” actually engaging in the principles they claim to represent might actually be a good idea, you know actually asking questions rather than listening to what some lying toerag psychos like jones or icke has to say.

Thus to attribute the 911 attacks to a “government inside job” , and at the same time to ignore the deceitful manipulation of the “truth movement” is to really ignore the rational and to delve into the ignorance.

Why?

Take your example of Northwoods, it was a secret project that could and was kept secret because it did not require too many people to carry it out if required. All it took was enough people to implement it, and since it was a military relatively easy to keep the whole business under wraps. Whistleblowers could be dealt with easily

Like the Manhattan project that developed the atom bomb. That was kept secret because you could limit access to the project and thus keep a lid of what could leak out.

As such, there is no way on this earth that attacks on the WTC could have been carried out as “inside job”. This is because, unlike Northwoods and Manhattan, bush would have had to include:

The NY firefighters
The NYC Police department
The courts for slapping gag orders on any investigation
All the people in the Pentagon
The more than 1,600 widows and widowers of 9/11
The entire sodding media
The photographers
Everyone in the NIST
EVERY STRUCTURAL ENGINEER IN THE WORLD
The CIA
The FBI
FEMA
The American Society of Civil Engineers
NORAD
FAA
The airliners who owned the planes that crashed
The airports from which the planes took off
EVERY SCIENTIST AND ENGINEER IN THE WHOLE AEROSPACE INDUSTRY

etc etc... the list goes one.

As such there would have been no way, no way that bush could have kept that conspiracy, and continue into perpetuity, from the worlds population.

Unless of course these loons are suggesting that bush and co were such intellectual giants as to keep the countless numbers of people that would have been involved so manipulated. Which of course is totally ridiculous!

What these people need to realise is that the world is huge place with a lot of people and institutes considerable complexities. It is not a place of black and white. It is possible that the government may make claims that do actually deal with reality, like the attacks were mostly carried out by crazed arabs - if so that’s that. Likewise there are some claims made by the “truth” movement that the government engaged in some suspicious activites, such as failing to deal with the airliners while in flight, that actually deal with reality – if so that’s that. That doesn’t mean just because the truthers may be correct in one area that means that they can be called upon to be regarded as oracles for the rest.

But then actually analysing the facts and ignoring common sense, logic and concepts such as Hanlon’s Razor won’t sell crappy books and dvds to the gullible.


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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 21:28 | IP Logged Quote blip

Outcast. I heard that as well. 'Twoofer'? Slip of the tongue I guess.

Colgrin. Which of the coincidental claims didn't you agree with?



Edited by blip on 23 February 2010 at 21:31


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Posted: 23 February 2010 at 22:57 | IP Logged Quote PaleRider

People can talk for ever and a day about how 9/11 could not be an inside job, but it is a possibility.

Did you know for instance that steel melting explosive material can be applied like paint? whats to say that the "work" being carried out in the "powerdowns" didn't have painters unknowingly painting the explosives on the walls etc..?

There are so many ways these buildings could be bought down with technology we may not even know about.

Why is it so hard to imagine that it could be an inside job? the US government wanted war in the middle east, they drew up their plans for the New American Century (Pnac) that indicated that so much could be acheived quicker if there was a "new pearl harbour"

I can well imagine Cheney throthing at the lips saying "lets have a new pearl harbour and get this ball rolling"

Northwoods was kept secret for 45 years, its possible to cover things up if you have enough power and the US government has that in spades.
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Colgrin
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Posted: 24 February 2010 at 09:54 | IP Logged Quote Colgrin

Yes the government does have the power to keep stuff like Northwoods secret, and as I have said that’s because these operations only require the government to use as many people as it needs to carry it out. Thus it can control the information and keep it within the project itself – any leaks can be controlled. This is particularly true of the military and since Northoods was a military operation, well you don’t need to be a genius to realise that peole would keep schtum.

As for the 911 inside job bollax. As I already said it required masses of people, military, scientific, the public etc etc:

The NY firefighters
The NYC Police department
The courts for slapping gag orders on any investigation
All the people in the Pentagon
The more than 1,600 widows and widowers of 9/11
The entire sodding media
The photographers
Everyone in the NIST
EVERY STRUCTURAL ENGINEER IN THE WORLD
The CIA
The FBI
FEMA
The American Society of Civil Engineers
NORAD
FAA
The airliners who owned the planes that crashed
The airports from which the planes took off
EVERY SCIENTIST AND ENGINEER IN THE WHOLE AEROSPACE INDUSTRY

etc etc... the list goes one.

What makes you think that the bush regime kept, and continues to keep, all those people under control? Don’t you think there would have been at least one or two whistleblowers?

Oh yeah, I forgot about the mass hypnosis mind control lizard technology developed by the Pentagon!

Get real.

Sure weird stuff happened within the building during that time. But why does it need to be a government conspiracy? There is a concept you may have heard called “sabotage”. The WTC was attacked by Islamic crazies in 1993 and those who were captured boasted that others would finish the job. Don’t you think that the next time they would hedge their bets and set out to destroy the building using more than one method?

Okay no one knows for sure, and I don’t have substantiated proof, but I think that it fits what we do know better than the totally ludicrous suggestion that it was an “inside job” perpetrated by bush, hateful and deceitful that he is. After all if the crazies were clever enough and determined enought to infiltrate an airport, take out 5 modern airliners and fly them into buildings, that they could infiltrate and sabotage a building to help them destroy the building.

Or are you trying to say that Arabs can’t read? Or enter buildings? Or use tools? That there are no arab pilots?


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Posted: 24 February 2010 at 17:51 | IP Logged Quote blip

So is it more likely that Arabs or ones in the US gov did this?

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Posted: 24 February 2010 at 18:19 | IP Logged Quote PaleRider

You are wrong Colgrin, it would not take all those people. Only the people at the very top need know what is really going on, its the same in any walk of life.

If and i say If this was an inside job by the US, i would go so far as to say even the President himself could be on the list of those not required to know what is really going on, but i doubt it as he has shown very odd behavior when questioned on 9/11.

This may have been planned for 10/20 years, this wasn't planned overnight.

Aaron russo revealed he was told by one Nick Rockefeller about an "event" that would change the world etc... and would lead to the military hunting in caves etc...  one year before.

You have got to admit that the ONLY people who benefitted from 9/11 were the US, Financially and politically.


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